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Just idle musings, but I'm wondering what clause in the constitution will be used to make this argument. It does sound weird, when you compare to like a policy that amounts to requiring every citizen to spend a minimum of say $100 a month at a fast food joint, but even if THAT policy were passed I'm confused about which article or clause in the constitution would prohibit it. I mean, last I looked there was nothing in the constitution that forbids a draft--that is, calling your reluctant ass up and sending you to the front lines--so I can't figure out how taking a lesser thing, namely your money, would be unconstitutional. I'm just interested in the legal reasoning here.

 

My two cents is that IF there is a constitutional basis to make this kind of argument, the feds have covered their asses by allowing people to opt out and pay a tax. Yeah, yeah, you can argue that taxes are illegal too--but that argument has had a tendency not to win. The law doesn't actually require a person to buy health insurance, just encourages them to buy it or pay a tax instead. Since we're already paying Medicare and Medicaid taxes, plus the government already has laws requiring public hospitals to treat all comers, I'm hard-pressed to see how a tax with an option not to pay it will be unconstitutional. The legal reasoning eludes me.

The constitution is a mandate by the people to the government outlining what the government CAN do (and only can do)!!! This document is not as such a "law" (which details what one cannot do)! The intent of the founders was to limit governments role, which allows the people to control the government! The precedent in this case, (and remember, precedent rules law) it seems to me, that Thomas Jefferson, Bennie Franklin, George Washington and the boys rul. As for the draft argument, the constitution gives the government the power to raise army's and defend the nation. But I'm not a lawyer. I would be interested in hearing from others on this. Respectfully

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Here are the words from the Constitution that give the Federal government supremacy over the states...all that is going to happen is that a lot of lawyers will collect very large fees, and nothing will change. Of course, some politicians will wave their arms a lot telling their constituents that they really tried to get it overturned, when all they really did is waste more of our money on something that is a foregone conclusion.

 

THE SUPREMACY CLAUSE

Article. VI.

 

This Constitution, and the Laws of the United States which shall be made in Pursuance thereof; and all Treaties made, or which shall be made, under the Authority of the United States, shall be the supreme Law of the Land; and the Judges in every State shall be bound thereby, any Thing in the Constitution or Laws of any State to the Contrary notwithstanding.

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Here are the words from the Constitution that give the Federal government supremacy over the states...all that is going to happen is that a lot of lawyers will collect very large fees, and nothing will change. Of course, some politicians will wave their arms a lot telling their constituents that they really tried to get it overturned, when all they really did is waste more of our money on something that is a foregone conclusion.

 

THE SUPREMACY CLAUSE

Article. VI.

 

This Constitution, and the Laws of the United States which shall be made in Pursuance thereof; and all Treaties made, or which shall be made, under the Authority of the United States, shall be the supreme Law of the Land; and the Judges in every State shall be bound thereby, any Thing in the Constitution or Laws of any State to the Contrary notwithstanding.

Only if the law is constitutional! Respectfully

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Only if the law is constitutional! Respectfully

And again, this is to be decided by the Supreams. The Court that is.

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And again, this is to be decided by the Supremes. The Court that is.

 

And I expect they will consider the intent of the following:

 

"We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America."

 

Definition of the word "welfare" as originally applied:

 

"Welfare

welfare n. 1. health, happiness, or prosperity; well-being. [<ME wel faren, to fare well] Source: AHD

 

Welfare in today's context also means organized efforts on the part of public or private organizations to benefit the poor, or simply public assistance. This is not the meaning of the word as used in the Constitution."

 

ref: The United States Constitution - http://www.usconstitution.net/const.html#Preamble

The Constitutional Dictionary - http://www.usconstitution.net/glossary.html#WELFARE

 

I'm no Supreme but it appears that there is reason to believe that HEALTH is a valid area for government activity.

Edited by stfree

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Right now there are 13 state attorneys general that are suing the government on the basis of constitutionality. Isn't it amazing that 12 of them are Republicans running for governor this year. But I guess using state funds to sue is cheaper than raising their own money to run a campaign.

 

And doesn't it seem just as obscene that so many on this site who collect Social Security while living in CR to take advantage of its social system decry a tiny step forward in the ole US of A. Or is it now that you have what you want, you want to prevent others from achieving the same? You may argue on philosophical points, but I have yet to see a single one of you say that you will give up any of your benefits, be they from the US or CR. The moment you are willing to do so, the rest of us may take you seriously.

 

Words are nice

But the wind can blow them away

It takes action

To keep the passion alive

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Right now there are 13 state attorneys general that are suing the government on the basis of constitutionality. Isn't it amazing that 12 of them are Republicans running for governor this year. But I guess using state funds to sue is cheaper than raising their own money to run a campaign.

 

And doesn't it seem just as obscene that so many on this site who collect Social Security while living in CR to take advantage of its social system decry a tiny step forward in the ole US of A. Or is it now that you have what you want, you want to prevent others from achieving the same? You may argue on philosophical points, but I have yet to see a single one of you say that you will give up any of your benefits, be they from the US or CR. The moment you are willing to do so, the rest of us may take you seriously.

 

Words are nice

But the wind can blow them away

It takes action

To keep the passion alive

Let us conduct a short review. I remember when I was a kid, and the government (Kennedy) went after Jimmy Hoffa because he lent money (at interest) from the teamsters pension fund to the mob so they could build their casinos in Nevada. According to my parents, Hoffa was a scumbag of the highest order for doing this, and was justly hounded into jail for his actions! Let us not forget that casinos and gambling were, and still are legal business in Nevada, and the loans were repaid! Let us now contrast this with our government that was obligated to put all funds collected for Social Security into a "trust fund" in order to provide for the future payments to the trusting citizens who provided funds to said "trust fund". Every politician whoe voted for the transfer of Social Security funds into the general fund should go to jail, for running a Ponzi scheme!! The proper tiny step forward for the good old USA should be for politicians to have the moral fortitude to do the correct thing, and not violate the law!! Respectfully

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